Why High Achievers Lose Their Identity: Eric Dahl on The Midnight Founders Podcast
For athletes, entrepreneurs, and other high achievers, success can become more than something you accomplish.
It can become who you are.
The athlete.
The founder.
The executive.
The person everyone expects to perform.
There is nothing inherently wrong with that. In fact, having a strong identity tied to achievement can provide tremendous motivation, discipline, structure, and purpose.
The problem comes when the thing that helped define you suddenly disappears.
I recently joined A.J. Rounds and Jacob McHargue on the Midnight Founders Podcast to talk about that challenge, the story behind Athlete5, and why losing an identity can be one of the most difficult parts of transitioning into a new chapter of life.
For athletes in particular, the question becomes very real:
Who are you when the jersey comes off?
When Achievement Becomes Identity
Athletes spend years building their lives around performance.
Practices.
Workouts.
Competition.
Teammates.
Coaches.
Goals.
Scoreboards.
There is always something to prepare for and something by which progress can be measured.
Eventually, however, the game ends.
Sometimes athletes know it's coming.
Other times an injury, roster decision, graduation, or unexpected circumstance makes the decision for them.
And suddenly the question isn't simply, “What am I going to do next?”
It's something deeper.
“Who am I now?”
That's one of the primary reasons Athlete5 exists.
During the conversation, I described the challenge another way:
What walked out of the locker room with you?
Because something did.
The discipline is still there.
The resilience is still there.
The ability to respond to coaching is still there.
The work ethic is still there.
The ability to perform under pressure is still there.
The game may have ended.
The person who became great at it did not.
When the Structure Disappears
One part of athlete transition that I believe deserves far more attention is the loss of structure.
Sports provide an enormous amount of it.
Practice is scheduled.
Workouts are scheduled.
Film sessions, meetings, travel, games, recovery, meals, and often sleep are structured around performance.
There is always a next practice.
A next opponent.
A next season.
Then the career ends and much of that structure can disappear almost overnight.
That can be incredibly disorienting.
The problem isn't that the athlete suddenly lacks ambition or discipline. They may simply have spent years operating inside a system that constantly told them where to go, what to work on, and how success would be measured.
Take away that system and even an extraordinarily driven person can temporarily lose direction.
The answer isn't to become less structured.
It's to build a new structure around a new mission.
Losing an Identity Doesn't Mean Losing Yourself
This part of the conversation became personal for me because I've experienced different versions of reinvention throughout my own life.
My athletic career didn't end the way I expected.
Years later, I built a career in real estate and thought I knew where my professional life was heading. Then the recession arrived and changed that plan dramatically.
Real estate eventually led me into marketing.
Marketing led to leadership, consulting, entrepreneurship, and opportunities I never could have mapped out beforehand.
Eventually, those experiences helped lead me to Athlete5.
Looking backward, there is a lesson in that.
Reinvention is not starting over.
You bring something with you.
Experience.
Relationships.
Failures.
Wins.
Skills.
Perspective.
The challenge is recognizing what those experiences taught you and intentionally carrying the right pieces forward.
That's especially true for athletes.
The jersey was something you wore.
The characteristics that allowed you to earn it are part of who you became.
Athletes and Entrepreneurs Have More in Common Than You Might Think
It was fitting to have this conversation on a podcast centered around entrepreneurship because athletes and entrepreneurs share many of the same characteristics.
Both require resilience.
Both demand consistency without any guarantee of the outcome.
Both involve competition, uncertainty, setbacks, and failure.
And both eventually punch you in the mouth.
The question isn't whether adversity comes.
It's how you respond when it does.
That's why one characteristic I've valued throughout my business career is what I call a can do attitude.
You don't have to know everything.
You don't need the perfect résumé.
You don't need every credential before taking the next step.
But you do need the willingness to learn, work, adapt, and be coached.
Athletes already understand that better than most.
The opportunity is learning how to transfer it into another arena.
Replacing the Scoreboard With a Report Card
We also spent time discussing Winning the Postgame and an idea at the heart of the book.
Athletes spend much of their lives looking at scoreboards.
The scoreboard provides immediate clarity.
Are we winning?
Are we losing?
What needs to change?
Then sports end and the scoreboard disappears.
But accountability shouldn't disappear with it.
That's where I believe a personal report card can help.
At Athlete5, we look at five core areas:
Purpose.
Mental Health.
Physical Health.
Spiritual Well Being.
Relationships.
The objective isn't perfection.
Life rarely operates in perfect balance.
At different times, different areas require more attention.
What matters is continuing to ask yourself:
Where am I doing well?
Where am I slipping?
Where do I need to put more effort next?
The scoreboard may disappear.
Accountability doesn't have to.
Rebuilding Identity With Intention
This is also where the Athlete5 Blueprint comes into the picture.
The Blueprint isn't designed to simply hand an athlete a list of potential careers.
It starts somewhere deeper.
Who are you?
What motivates you?
What are you naturally good at?
What matters to you?
What did sport develop inside you?
Where can those characteristics create value somewhere else?
And what might a successful, balanced next chapter actually look like?
The objective is clarity.
Because losing the identity of “athlete” doesn't mean losing your identity altogether.
It creates an opportunity to understand that identity more completely.
You aren't replacing who you were.
You're discovering what else you can become.
Your Best Chapters May Still Be Ahead
Maybe that's the larger message from our entire conversation.
Your best chapters may be ahead, not behind you.
That's difficult to believe when you've spent years performing at an elite level.
Sport creates moments that are almost impossible to duplicate.
But the objective isn't to duplicate them.
It's to build something new.
To take the discipline, relationships, resilience, perspective, and lessons developed through sports and apply them to a different game.
The jersey may come off.
The scoreboard may disappear.
The structure may change.
But the person who walked out of that locker room still has enormous value.
The next challenge is understanding who that person is becoming.
And then giving them something meaningful to compete for again.
Watch the Full Midnight Founders Podcast
My thanks to A.J. Rounds and Jacob McHargue for having me on the Midnight Founders Podcast for a conversation that extended well beyond Athlete5.
We talked about athlete identity, entrepreneurship, mental health, reinvention, discomfort, purpose, balance, fatherhood, and what it takes to continue evolving when one chapter of life gives way to another.
Episoide Link Here.
Full Episode Transcript
The following transcript has been lightly edited for clarity and readability while preserving the substance of the original conversation:
Introduction
0:00
A.J. Rounds: All right, welcome back to another episode of the Midnight Founders Podcast. Today we are lucky enough to be in studio with Eric Dahl. Welcome.
Eric Dahl: Great to be here.
A.J.: He's an author and founder of Athlete5, so we're excited to hear his story.
Eric and I have been friends for a while, and Eric has more marketing expertise and knowledge in his pinky than Jake and I do in our whole bodies. He is the marketing genius.
The second thing I'll say about Eric is his shoe collection is by far the best in Utah. He has got the best shoes.
Eric: Well, thank you. But I'm also noticing you're coming equipped with your own Nikes. You've got the Stance socks today. Jake's got the 270s on. I'm in good company here.
Jacob McHargue: The 270s are my go to. I think this is like my tenth pair.
A.J.: We try. One day we may get a little bit closer to that bar Eric sets because your shoes are always so impressive. What do you have on right now?
Eric: I've got on some Air Jordan 3s.
But addiction is real, man. I've been a sneakerhead since I was 10 years old, and it's a slippery slope. We all have our vices.
My girlfriend calls it "shoeping" when I'm shopping for shoes. I've doom scrolled on plenty of apps way too long.
Jacob: I've noticed going through Parade homes recently that it's now a trend where the master bedroom is the master bedroom, but the closet is three times the size of the master bedroom to fit the shoes.
Eric: Priorities.
What Is Athlete5?
1:42
A.J.: Why don't you tell us a little bit about Athlete5? Then we'd love to hear about the book.
Eric: The mission of Athlete5 is to empower former elite athletes with greater clarity, balance, and direction for a better life after sports.
I feel like so much time and energy has been put into helping athletes during their careers. Even now, with the landscape of collegiate sports, NIL, and everything happening there, there's a lot of focus on these athletes during their careers.
But then everything comes to a screeching halt.
And it will for everyone at some point, whether that's collegiate, professional, or whatever the case.
There's not a lot set up for those individuals. It can be a very difficult time for athletes to transition into, "Okay, what are my next chapters going to look like?"
Athlete5 helps bridge that gap. It helps provide clarity and direction to elite athletes for greater success after sports.
Jacob: Is that more on a career consulting basis, or maybe helping them become leaders? How are you helping them specifically?
Eric: It's a little bit of everything.
The reason I named it Athlete5 has a dual meaning.
First, a lot of sports games have four quarters. This is the fifth quarter. This is after the game.
The other component is the five pillars we focus on: purpose, mental health, physical health, spiritual well being, and relationships.
We're not just trying to help someone answer, "What's my next logical step for my career?"
It's also: How do I have a more balanced and happy life?
Jacob: I would think it's very needed. If I remember correctly, even for professional athletes, the amount of time they're actually in the industry as a professional is very small.
Eric: Yep.
There's such an identity formed throughout sports where it's like, "This is who I am. This is where I excel. This is how people know me."
But when that jersey comes off, it's:
Who am I now?
What we try to do is ask:
What walked out of the locker room with you?
These are immensely talented individuals.
I think most people have seen former athletes trying to transition into life after sports. Some athletes do a great job. They springboard. They know exactly where they're going.
But for every athlete who falls into that camp, there are others who struggle.
Their talents are immense, and those talents can transfer.
We're here to remind them: "Here's where you can be great. Here's what you can do."
We're here to support and enlighten them that their best chapters may be ahead, not behind them.
Jacob: So you're aligning their specific skill sets with interests or opportunities that are aligned with what they naturally could do?
Eric: One hundred percent.
The Athlete5 Blueprint and Winning the Postgame
5:16
Eric: One of the things we have is obviously the book. The book is a starting point.
A.J.: Congratulations, by the way. That's kind of cool.
Eric: Writing a book is an undertaking.
A.J.: How many months have you been working on it?
Eric: I've been working on the book for at least two years.
It's not that it took me two years to write it. It was more, "How do I want to message this? How do I position it so it's saying the things I believe will be the most valuable?"
Then it was polishing it up.
Like you said, I'm a marketer, so I'll go through and refine things. How do I make it simpler? How do I make it more succinct?
Beyond the book, we have the Athlete5 Blueprint, which is kind of a StrengthsFinder and Kolbe Index on steroids that has been created for these athletes.
That's designed to help them understand, "These are my talents. These are my characteristics."
Then, with that understanding, we can begin identifying opportunities for where they can apply those traits and be most successful.
Eric's Own Transition Out of Sports
6:32
Jacob: Why did you choose this? Were you a college athlete?
Eric: Great question.
I've been around athletics my whole life. To answer your question, I wasn't a college athlete.
Coming out of high school, and this is a story within the book, I was getting some attention as a high school basketball player.
Jacob: What position did you play?
Eric: I'm 6'6", but I was a center, which nowadays is a completely different game than it was in the late '90s.
Everybody shoots from beyond the arc now. It's such a three point centric game.
But the coaches were all telling me, "Eric, this team is yours. We're going to do all these great things."
Then something happened during my senior year that shook my whole world.
That became my own transition out of sports.
What shook my world was dealing with anxiety and depression.
That was a game changer on so many fronts.
It was confusing. It was rough. And there were fewer resources back then for that.
I'd been prescribed medication that was supposed to help me. It helped a little bit, but the problem was it took every ounce of my energy.
I went from being this basketball player who loved playing basketball to running up and down the court twice and feeling like I was going to die because I was so gassed.
That forced me to look at life outside of sports.
A.J.: So you've almost seen that transition within yourself, where you're saying, "Okay, if you wipe away the sports element, who am I? What am I doing?"
You probably lived that at that moment.
Eric: I lived it in that moment.
I served an LDS mission. I came home from my mission and thought, "Do I want to walk on and play basketball somewhere?"
I remember going to my college at the time and taking this Scantron test.
It was kind of a primitive version of what we offer now. It was designed to understand your talents and interests. You'd submit your Scantron and get the results back in the mail two weeks later saying, "Here are some careers that might fit your path."
It was a little enlightening.
But it was really about understanding:
Who am I?
Where are my unique skill sets and traits going to help me be at my best?
It was a transition I wasn't prepared for.
I think many who go through the same transition, especially elite athletes, find it difficult to understand:
"How am I going to be at my best after this?"
"Where do I want to shift my focus for the rest of my life?"
That's part of the foundation of Athlete5.
I've gone through my own version of that.
Sports have remained a central part of my life. I worked for the State Athletic Commission for a time. I've boxed for training, worked with MMA fighters, played in basketball leagues.
Sports are very near and dear to my heart.
Along the way, I've had relationships with professional fighters, professional basketball players, and other athletes.
I've watched this play out time and time again.
You have the athletes who know where they're going.
Then you have others who really struggle.
That's where I thought:
There's an opportunity here.
It's always been in the back of my mind.
You ask entrepreneurs when they come on your show, "Why did you choose this?"
I almost feel like Athlete5, the whole framework, chose me.
Losing Structure After Sports
10:29
A.J.: That's cool.
What I love about your model specifically is that these athletes are coming from an environment where they're being coached on a continual basis.
They're very used to that model.
You're transitioning that same model into, "Now what do you do after sports?"
They've got that coach, if you will, to continue with them through life.
Eric: I'm a college dropout.
A.J.: So many people on the podcast are. You would be amazed.
Eric: I'm sure of that.
I'm the last person to undermine the importance of a formal education. It just wasn't in the cards for me.
However, there are things you remember from your college days. Not a lot, especially as I get older.
But I remember sitting in a psychology class and the instructor saying children crave one thing more than anything else:
Structure.
It's a subconscious thing.
But I believe that's baked within all of us.
Looking at it from an athletic standpoint, once that structure is taken away from these athletes, it's almost like there's a panic of sorts.
If we can reestablish structure moving forward, that's where greater success usually lies.
Athletes do well within structure.
Jacob: A lot of athletes, when they hit that void, turn to other things.
Eric: Yeah. And you can very easily go down dark paths.
A.J.: There's that quote in Moneyball that says we're all told at some point in our lives that we can't play the childhood game anymore.
Sometimes it happens way earlier in life.
It was an identity crisis for me. Baseball was my entire life growing up.
When I got cut in high school, it was crippling. It took me a while to reinvent myself.
Eric: We've all faced that, whether there's an athletic component or not.
There's a shift where it's:
"Okay, I have to reinvent myself now."
"What does that look like?"
"Where can I best put my foot forward and really make a difference?"
It's a challenging episode because it takes time.
Identity Beyond Athletics
12:49
Jacob: What about professionals or founders listening to this show who think, "I'm going to move into a different industry," or they've sold their business, or maybe the business didn't work out?
They're reidentifying or reimagining themselves somewhere else.
Would Athlete5 be helpful for them too, or is it really geared toward athletes?
Eric: It's really geared toward athletes.
But I've had friends read and buy the book who didn't have athletic backgrounds, and they've said the principles still apply.
As you're reading through it, you can ask, "How can I apply this to myself? Does this resonate with me?"
Athlete5 is geared toward athletes transitioning out of sports, but I also think there's a very real connection for anyone going through a major transition.
You talk about going through that professionally.
I went through that during the recession.
I was in real estate. As a twenty something, I'd moved into a million dollar house, which at the time felt crazy.
I thought I was indestructible.
I thought, "This is just going to continue getting better and better. The gravy train has taken off, and it's going to keep picking up speed."
Then the recession hit.
Everything we were working on came to a screeching halt.
For example, we'd flown over to meet with the Bank of Scotland about a project we were working on.
In one meeting, they told us, "You bring 20 percent of the capital to the table and we'll fund 80 percent."
Within about two weeks, it changed to, "You bring 80 percent to the table and we'll fund 20 percent."
That killed everything.
I was looking at my life thinking:
Where do I go from here?
Real estate was dead.
That's when I realized I had some creative chops. My dad had worked in advertising for decades. I felt like I'd picked up some things and knew some of the tricks of the trade.
That began my evolution into marketing.
But it came because of a transition I was not planning for.
So many founders you meet have their own stories like this.
Ultimately, it's a matter of:
Where can I be at my best?
Where can I provide value?
What work can I do that, when I lay my head on my pillow at night, I'm excited to get back into the next day?
How Past Chapters Prepare Us for What's Next
15:42
A.J.: Just talking to you right now, you come alive as you're speaking about this. It feels like this is your passion. This is your hot button.
How have some of the things you've done in the past prepared you for what you're doing now?
You've helped build and grow multiple marketing agencies.
Eric: I think it's the same thing.
The traits transfer.
When you're dedicated and approach something with, "How can I add more value?" you're going to succeed.
Then you can take those learnings and apply them to what's next.
Careers are funny things.
I like the adage, "Man plans and God laughs."
I feel like that's so true.
We have these plans. "This is how I'm going to make my mark. This is what I'm going to do."
Then reality sets in and you may be nudged or led toward different opportunities.
If you can approach those opportunities with the mentality of, "Here's how I can be at my best," and with a can do attitude, good things are going to follow.
I think the can do attitude trumps almost everything.
Jacob: That grit is so important, isn't it?
Eric: Grit and resilience.
It's like Mike Tyson said: everybody has a game plan until they get punched in the mouth.
Life is going to punch you in the mouth.
Especially as an entrepreneur, it's going to happen early and often.
A.J.: It's almost like you're begging for it.
Eric: It's true.
It's like, man, you must be a glutton for punishment if you want to be an entrepreneur.
That's the hard thing.
There's a depth to entrepreneurship where, on the surface, you can go meet with people, have good conversations, come on a podcast, and somebody might think, "Wow, that guy has it all put together."
But if you're fighting the entrepreneurship battle, there are days where you go home thinking, "Okay, how am I going to pay my power bill next month unless this comes in?"
That's where it gets real.
That grit and determination are things you have to embrace.
Winning the Postgame and the Athlete5 Report Card
18:17
Jacob: It's interesting. There are so many synergies between sports and entrepreneurship.
I want to learn more about the book. How does it work together with Athlete5, or are they completely separate products?
Eric: They work hand in hand.
The book is Winning the Postgame.
I was actually building Athlete5 behind the scenes and having conversations with former athletes almost as a side hustle for a while.
It was a side hustle on the down low. Nobody knew I was working on this.
I had business partners, and this was kind of my passion project. It was like, "Okay, this will reach the light of day eventually, but not yet."
A.J.: You kept it in stealth mode for a while.
Eric: Exactly.
When I started putting Athlete5 together, writing a book was never part of the equation.
But I always say ideas never come fully formed.
As I got more and more into this, I thought a book could help with the more holistic offering of Athlete5.
Within the book, I talk about going on hikes.
I love to hike, and usually I'll go hiking with my girlfriend.
She's really good about asking me about my report card.
My report card is essentially:
How are you doing?
It goes back to the Athlete5 pillars: purpose, mental health, physical health, spiritual well being, and relationships.
I give myself a grade in each of those areas.
That's something I usually do on any hike that lasts longer than 30 minutes with my girlfriend.
I started thinking about Athlete5 and how athletes are so programmed to look at a scoreboard and understand:
"Here's where we're at."
"That means we've got to do this to win the game."
But once the game comes to an end, the scoreboard is gone.
That's where the report card can make a difference.
Winning the Postgame is focused in part on a personal report card that helps you understand how well you're attacking the game of life, where you're getting ahead, and where you need to improve.
Jacob: It's kind of like your KPIs.
Eric: Exactly.
It's your KPIs.
And when you say KPIs, really it's accountability.
Accountability is tough.
Even on these hikes, the questions I'm asked by my girlfriend are supportive, but they're intrusive in the best way.
They help me see:
"Oh, I'm letting it slip in this category. I can do better."
Or:
"I'm doing well here right now, but I can't rest on my laurels. I need to continue pushing forward."
It's a scorecard that replaces the scoreboard.
Accountability, Balance, and the Athlete5 Circle
20:34
Jacob McHargue: Kind of like your KPIs.
Eric Dahl: Exactly. It’s your KPIs.
And when you say KPIs, really it’s accountability. Accountability is tough.
Even on these hikes, the questions I’m asked by my girlfriend are supportive, but they’re intrusive in the best way because they help me see:
“Oh, I’m letting it slip in this category. I can do better.”
Or:
“I’m doing well here right now, but I can’t rest on my laurels. I need to continue pushing forward.”
So it’s more of a scorecard that replaces the scoreboard.
A.J. Rounds: It’s so good that you have a relationship like that that helps you grow. It exposes your vulnerabilities and helps you see your blind spots.
So awesome for keeping her around, really listening, and taking to heart what she says. That’s cool.
Eric: Yeah, I’m lucky.
And we’re all fighting the same battle, right?
We’re looking at it from the perspective of living a fully balanced life.
If you were to get up on a whiteboard and try to draw the perfectly balanced circle, how many times are you going to be able to draw a perfect circle?
Jacob: Never.
Eric: Never.
And that’s kind of like our lives.
You can think, “Okay, I’m doing pretty well, but there’s an area over here that needs some attention.”
Jacob: In my circle, for sure. Thinking about my circle, it’s like, “Oh yeah, I can definitely do better in this area or this area.”
Burnout, Overthinking, and Being Present
22:09
A.J.: Tell us more about your hiking and how that clears the air and clears your brain out, because I think entrepreneurs don’t take enough time to reset and recharge.
It’s a big problem.
Burnout is such an issue we see on the podcast all the time with founders and business owners.
Tell us about that.
Eric: I think you can get so wrapped up in your thoughts.
I’m a person who overthinks, and that’s one of the issues I have as a human. I think way too much.
A.J.: Does it prevent you from acting sometimes because you’re overthinking too much? You become paralyzed with fear, right?
Eric: I think that has been something I’ve had to work on throughout my life.
But I look at it from the perspective of, “Okay, what can I do to disrupt the normal routine?”
Whether that’s hiking or going to the gym and lifting weights, it’s like, “Let’s get the blood pumping.”
With that, you’re able to get outside of your own worrisome mindset and be more present.
It forces you to be present.
I remember a good friend of mine, who is also my doctor, told me to read a book called The Power of Now by Eckhart Tolle.
The Power of Now focuses on being present at all times. Being intensely present.
That comes with practice.
A.J.: I need more practice.
Eric: It’s very hard to do.
It’s hard to maintain because the mind is continuously coming up with problems, and you’ve got to battle away those problems.
I’ve found that one of the ways I can battle those problems is to get on a trail or go into a gym.
And it’s not an egotistical thing for me to go to the gym now.
It’s, “Let me escape, but escape into reality, where I can focus on myself and also ask, ‘How am I going to win the day?’”
It’s the perfect opportunity to do that.
Deliberately Facing Discomfort
24:20
Jacob: I’m a rock climber, so I follow a bunch of those guys.
My wife, kids, and I went to Yosemite this summer, so we watched the Alex Honnold documentary before we went.
Eric: Oh man.
Jacob: Free Solo.
Eric: That was insane.
Jacob: You think it’s insane until you go to Yosemite, and then it’s like, “That is really insane.”
We climbed Half Dome. Well, we hiked Half Dome. He free climbed Half Dome.
Eric: I could hardly get through that movie. It was so intense.
Jacob: When you’re on the actual wall, it’s truly insane.
But he talks about this concept of how, as a society, we really don’t face fear anymore.
Our brains have generated things to trigger that fear response.
The way we react in daily situations becomes exaggerated.
Alex Honnold talks about putting yourself in these dangerous situations, not situations where you’re actually at risk of dying, but putting yourself outside your comfort zone.
Then having your flight delayed no longer seems like a big deal.
If you were just on a wall where one slip meant an injury or falling 20 feet, the daily trials you face in life start to feel mundane.
It makes you more able to face the anxieties of daily life.
I thought it was a really interesting concept because, as entrepreneurs, it’s very easy to have one issue with your business and make that seem way more important and impactful than it really is.
Eric: No question.
I watched that documentary, and I’m afraid of heights to begin with. That’s why I could hardly watch it.
I went bungee jumping once to conquer my fear.
I’ll never go bungee jumping again.
A.J.: Once was enough?
Eric: Once was enough.
But it’s that same idea.
There is value in deliberately putting yourself into situations that are uncomfortable.
I think we grow when we’re uncomfortable.
If everything is always comfortable, if everything is always easy, there isn’t a lot of growth taking place.
Sports teach that naturally.
You’re constantly pushing yourself.
You’re constantly uncomfortable.
You’re constantly trying to get stronger, faster, better.
And then sometimes we enter other chapters of life and start avoiding discomfort.
But there’s value in continuing to seek it out in healthy ways.
Entrepreneurship and Getting Punched in the Mouth
The conversation returned to the similarities between athletics and entrepreneurship, particularly the reality that neither path guarantees success simply because someone works hard.
Eric: Entrepreneurship will humble you.
You can have the greatest plan in the world, and then something happens that completely changes the equation.
That’s where the athletic mentality can become so valuable.
You lose a game.
Okay.
What did we learn?
What do we change?
What do we do tomorrow?
You don’t sit there forever mourning the loss.
You study it, learn from it, and get back to work.
That mentality translates beautifully into entrepreneurship.
You have to be resilient.
You have to be coachable.
You have to be willing to hear things you don’t necessarily want to hear.
And sometimes you have to accept that the game plan you came in with simply isn’t working.
That’s difficult for entrepreneurs because ego can get involved.
But it’s also difficult for athletes transitioning out of sports because they may have spent years being incredibly good at something.
Now they’re entering an environment where they might be a rookie again.
There has to be humility in that.
You might have been the captain.
You might have been the star.
You might have had thousands of people cheering for you.
And now you’re walking into something new where nobody necessarily cares about any of that.
What matters is:
Can you learn?
Can you contribute?
Can you make the people around you better?
Can you bring that can do attitude into the room?
If you can, I think there’s tremendous opportunity.
Relationships and the People Around You
The conversation also moved into the importance of relationships and the people who surround someone during periods of transition.
Eric: Relationships are one of the five pillars for a reason.
I think sometimes we underestimate just how much the people around us influence the direction of our lives.
That applies personally and professionally.
You need people who are willing to tell you the truth.
You need people who support you.
You need people who challenge you.
And professionally, you need to build relationships before you need something from them.
That’s something I wish I understood much earlier in my career.
I’m an introvert.
People don’t necessarily believe that because I’ll speak publicly, go to events, and meet people.
But I’m very comfortable being by myself.
There was a period where I avoided networking because it felt uncomfortable.
Eventually I realized how shortsighted that was.
Some of the greatest opportunities in my career have come through relationships.
But I also learned that networking works much better when you stop thinking about what you’re going to get out of it.
Go into a room asking:
“How can I help somebody?”
That changes everything.
It makes networking feel less transactional because it is less transactional.
You’re building relationships.
And those relationships can become incredibly meaningful over time.
For an athlete transitioning out of sports, that can be especially important.
Your network inside the sport may be tremendous.
But you also need relationships outside the game.
People who can expose you to different industries, opportunities, ideas, and ways of thinking.
That’s something athletes can begin building before their playing careers ever end.
The Importance of Purpose
As the discussion continued, purpose emerged as another central theme behind Athlete5.
Eric: Purpose is the first pillar for a reason.
If you don’t know what you’re working toward, everything else becomes harder.
That doesn’t mean you need to wake up tomorrow morning and suddenly know your grand purpose in life.
I think sometimes we put too much pressure on that word.
Purpose can evolve.
But you need something that gets you moving.
Athletes have that naturally during sports.
There’s a game.
There’s a season.
There’s a championship.
There’s something they’re chasing.
When that disappears, there can be this enormous void.
That’s where you have to start asking:
“What matters to me now?”
“What am I interested in?”
“Where can I contribute?”
“Who can I help?”
“What gets me excited?”
Those questions begin to create direction.
And direction creates momentum.
Mental Health and the Athlete Transition
The hosts and Eric also discussed the mental health component of major life transitions and the danger of defining oneself entirely through achievement.
Eric: Mental health is obviously very personal for me because of my own experience.
I’ve dealt with anxiety and depression.
I know what it feels like when your mind isn’t cooperating with what you want to accomplish.
And I think athletes can be especially vulnerable during transition because so much changes simultaneously.
Your structure changes.
Your social circle can change.
Your identity changes.
Your physical routine changes.
Your income may change.
Your purpose can feel like it changes.
That’s a lot.
We shouldn’t pretend that someone can simply flip a switch and say, “Okay, sports are over. What’s next?”
There can be grieving involved.
And I think it’s important to acknowledge that.
But I’m also an optimist.
I believe you can work through those chapters.
You can get help.
You can create new structure.
You can find new purpose.
And you can build a life that is incredibly fulfilling after sports.
That’s the message I want athletes to understand.
Physical Health After Competition
The conversation connected physical health to the larger Athlete5 framework as well.
Eric: Physical health is another interesting one because athletes have spent years having people tell them exactly what to do physically.
They have trainers.
They have strength coaches.
They have nutrition programs.
They have practices.
Their body is part of their job.
Then they retire.
Nobody is necessarily telling them what to do anymore.
And life starts happening.
You have a career.
You have a family.
You have responsibilities.
Suddenly physical health can move down the priority list.
But it shouldn’t.
You may not need to train like a professional athlete anymore, but you still need to take care of yourself.
Exercise affects everything.
It affects mental health.
It affects energy.
It affects confidence.
It affects how you show up professionally and personally.
The goal changes.
You’re no longer necessarily training to compete on Saturday.
You’re training to live well.
Spiritual Well Being and Looking Beyond Yourself
Eric: Spiritual well being is probably the pillar that can mean the most different things to different people.
I’m a person of faith.
That matters to me.
But Athlete5 isn’t about telling somebody what they have to believe.
It’s about understanding that there’s value in looking beyond yourself.
That could be prayer.
It could be meditation.
It could be scripture study.
It could be service.
It could be spending time in nature.
There’s something healthy about recognizing that the entire world doesn’t revolve around you.
Especially when you’ve spent years in an environment where so much attention may have been placed on your performance.
Sometimes peace comes from getting outside yourself.
Serving someone.
Helping someone.
Connecting with something bigger.
That can bring tremendous perspective.
Success Beyond the Career
The conversation broadened from athletes to founders and other high achievers who can easily allow professional achievement to dominate their identities.
Eric: I think this applies to entrepreneurs too.
If your entire identity is:
“I’m the CEO.”
“I’m the founder.”
“I built this company.”
What happens when you sell it?
What happens when it fails?
What happens when the board replaces you?
What happens when you simply decide you don’t want to do it anymore?
If your identity is completely tied to achievement, you’re vulnerable.
That’s why I like looking at life through those five pillars.
Your career matters.
Purpose matters.
But so do your relationships.
Your health matters.
Your mental health matters.
Your spiritual well being matters.
You can be crushing it professionally and failing everywhere else.
Is that success?
I don’t think it is.
That’s why balance matters.
Not perfect balance.
There’s no such thing.
But awareness.
Understanding where you’re doing well and where something needs attention.
Fatherhood and What Really Matters
The discussion eventually turned toward family, parenting, and how priorities change through different seasons of life.
Eric: Being a dad has probably taught me more than anything else.
There are things professionally that feel incredibly important in the moment.
You’re worried about a deal.
You’re worried about a client.
You’re worried about money.
You’re worried about whatever fire happens to be burning that day.
Then you get home and your kids don’t care about any of that.
They care whether you’re there.
They care whether you’re listening.
They care whether you show up.
That brings perspective quickly.
And again, that goes back to the report card.
Maybe professionally I’m getting an A.
Great.
But what am I getting as a father?
What am I getting in my relationships?
What am I getting in my physical health?
Those grades matter too.
Maybe more.
The Gnarliest Part of Entrepreneurship
As with other Midnight Founders guests, the conversation eventually reached the question the show asks entrepreneurs about their most difficult experiences.
A.J.: We ask everybody this question.
What’s the gnarliest experience you’ve had as an entrepreneur?
Eric: I think the recession has to be up there.
Being in my twenties and thinking I had figured everything out, then watching it disappear.
That was humbling.
When you’ve built your identity around being successful and suddenly things aren’t successful anymore, you have to look in the mirror.
That experience taught me that you cannot assume the chapter you’re in today is going to last forever.
And that’s probably another reason Athlete5 resonates so deeply with me.
Athletes experience that on an accelerated timeline.
They can be on top of the world and then suddenly it changes.
In business, sometimes we get decades before that transition happens.
Athletes might get a few years.
That’s why preparation matters.
Why Athlete5 Exists
As the episode moved toward its conclusion, the discussion returned to the central mission behind Athlete5.
Eric: At its core, I want Athlete5 to be a resource.
I want athletes to know that there is tremendous life after sports.
There’s tremendous opportunity.
But I also don’t want to sugarcoat the transition.
It can be hard.
If your entire identity has been tied to what you do athletically, you’re going to have to do some work to understand who you are beyond that.
That’s why we created the Blueprint.
It’s about creating clarity.
Understanding:
Who are you?
What are your strengths?
What drives you?
What matters to you?
What are your interests?
Where can you provide value?
And then how do we take those answers and begin building something?
The Blueprint isn’t supposed to say, “Congratulations, here’s your next job.”
That’s not the point.
The point is to give you greater clarity about yourself so you can make better decisions about what comes next.
Your Best Chapters May Be Ahead
Eric: I come back to this all the time.
Your best chapters may be ahead, not behind you.
I think that’s important for athletes to hear.
Because imagine being 28 years old and somebody basically tells you:
“That thing you’ve spent your entire life becoming great at? You’re done.”
That’s difficult.
But you’re 28.
You have an enormous amount of life ahead of you.
What are you going to do with it?
The game gave you something.
It developed you.
It taught you discipline.
It taught you resilience.
It taught you teamwork.
It taught you how to lose.
It taught you how to win.
It taught you how to prepare.
Now take those things with you.
The game ends.
You do not.
That’s the message.
Closing Thoughts
A.J.: Where can people learn more about Athlete5 and connect with you?
Eric: Athlete5.com is the best place.
You can learn more about the book, Winning the Postgame, the Athlete5 Blueprint, and the Elite Advisory.
You can also connect with me through the website or social channels.
And really, if somebody is going through this transition, or knows somebody who is, I’m happy to be a resource.
That’s what we’re trying to build.
A.J.: Awesome. We appreciate you coming in.
Jacob: Yeah, this was great.
Eric: Thank you guys. I appreciate you having me.
